Christian Homosexuality

[Titus]

I believe that they can, but that it puts a barrier between them and God. This is where my opinion of ES comes into play, and I really don't want to head down that trail here, but there seems to be a line that is crossed somewhere. Christians can behave in sinful ways, but they shouldn't. As Titus said, David sinned and he reaped the whirlwind because of it - but he repented of his sin. I believe that a Christian can find themselves in a sinful lifestyle, and still be - well, saved, for lack of better term. However, when the Spirit convicts them, either through individual revelation or single/group intervention (and He always will), and they don't repent, then they are done.

I agree. The only place that we likely disagree is, to my thinking, if they don't repent, their faith was not genuine to begin with.

Hmmm. . . Perhaps this is tied deeper into by ES beliefs than I thought. If so, Titus, I fully understand if you choose not to continue in this discussion. I don't want to fight with you. Discuss, yes. Fight, no. Lol! I promise not to argue about ES in this thread.

It's difficult to discuss it without someone getting angry. Almost every time I've tried to have a civil discussion they will usually get frustrated because I just don't change my position, and I'll usually end up hearing something like, that's a lie from hell, or you just want to believe that so you can live any way you want to, and I respond in kind and it's on. But...we will all find out one day, and I imagine all of us will be surprised about what we got wrong.

[Benjie]

Yeah, like being in a loving committed relationship somehow makes it okay. It doesn't make it okay for peole of the same sex to live together out of wedlock, even though they may be in a loving committed relationship.

Yeah. This is actually one of the reasons that some of them want gay marriage.

I guess my thing is, I can't read a heart. Only God can. I know what God's word says, but I also know that God gives us examples in his word of people who committed grave sins who were and remained to be His children. Moses committed murder. David - murder and adultery. Peter denied Jesus.
It's not up to us to judge them. That is not to say that we condone or otherwise endorse that relationship. No it's clear what the Bible calls it, and it ain't pretty, but honestly, I tink the christian community owes the gay community an apology, because instead of loving them like Jesus, we stand on street corners with signs that say God hates fags. Yeah I know, Westboro is a fringe group, and very few christians actually do that, but how many christians secretly say, "got that right!"? I just feel like they are a community that collectively we have failed just because we find their sin so distasteful.

Exactly! How many of us react or shrink back, or even say "oh . . ." when someone comes out to us? Not to say that Jesus would take their hand and go skipping through the streets with them, but we need to check ourselves.

[Benjie]

I agree. The only place that we likely disagree is, to my thinking, if they don't repent, their faith was not genuine to begin with.

It's difficult to discuss it without someone getting angry. Almost every time I've tried to have a civil discussion they will usually get frustrated because I just don't change my position, and I'll usually end up hearing something like, that's a lie from hell, or you just want to believe that so you can live any way you want to, and I respond in kind and it's on. But...we will all find out one day, and I imagine all of us will be surprised about what we got wrong.

One day, I would like to attempt a civil discussion about ES with you. Again, not to argue, but I find that debate causes me to dig deeper into the word - so it's not to prove you wrong, but more to find out what I truly believe. I'm not a five point Arminian, just as I don't think you are a five point Calvinist. There are things, even within the doctrine that we agree with, where there is some dissonance.

And yes, every single one of us will be shocked when we reach heaven. No doubt about that!

[HisDaughter]

Is a person born gay? This is why I used the example of my co-worker. There is no gene that a person is born gay no difference in blood only, nothing. Now this might be a different thread altogether.

So a "being" is only gay based on a perverted attraction. I might get slammed for this but, I haven't found any scientific proof.

[Benjie]

Benjie, there are many many people who proclaim to be Christians who really are those who just asked Jesus into their hearts but don't really follow what he has told us to do (and not to do) and in the end will be among those who will be rejected because they practice iniquity.



I have known several very nice and caring homosexuals in my 65 years, but they are according to scripture in great spiritual danger. Problem is that the way to help them is not to shun them, though I could never be real friends with any of them. but we should not cast them totally out of our lives, though we should let it be known that their lifestyle is outside our realm of acceptability. We should aways be available to let the Spirit use us to make them understand.
I hope that makes some kind of sense....

Absolutely.

My problem is that I find that my circles don't involve the gay community at all. It's not that I shun them, but I simply am not around them (that I am aware of, at least).

[Benjie]

Is a person born gay? This is why I used the example of my co-worker. There is no gene that a person is born gay no difference in blood only, nothing. Now this might be a different thread altogether.

So a "being" is only gay based on a perverted attraction. I might get slammed for this but, I haven't found any scientific proof.

No scientific proof either way. There have been plenty of studies to determine of it's nature or nurture, but none of them have been conclusive. All we can go by are anecdotal testimonies. To them, it just "feels right" and being with the opposite sex "feels wrong" or simply isn't as fulfilling.

No reason to be slammed. I think that if we can engage in civil responses, there shouldn't be any slamming or arguing at all.

[HisDaughter]

No scientific proof either way. There have been plenty of studies to determine of it's nature or nurture, but none of them have been conclusive. All we can go by are anecdotal testimonies. To them, it just "feels right" and being with the opposite sex "feels wrong" or simply isn't as fulfilling.

No reason to be slammed. I think that if we can engage in civil responses, there shouldn't be any slamming or arguing at all.

Well until it is proved otherwise there is no such "being" that is gay. Having an attraction to the same sex is perverted just like any other sin. We are all born in sin.

[dave]

Well until it is proved otherwise there is no such "being" that is gay. Having an attraction to the same sex is perverted just like any other sin. We are all born in sin.

I agree with you about it being a perversion. But if you were to bering this up to someone who defends homosexuality, they'll start point to monkeys that use (male/male) activity in their social communication. Personally I don't see how monkeys compare to humans...nor do I believe these animals are actually doing this because of an attraction for one another...but it's an argument that gets made often in the "gay rights" arena.

[Hansc]

I agree with you about it being a perversion. But if you were to bering this up to someone who defends homosexuality, they'll start point to monkeys that use (male/male) activity in their social communication. Personally I don't see how monkeys compare to humans...nor do I believe these animals are actually doing this because of an attraction for one another...but it's an argument that gets made often in the "gay rights" arena.

Monkeys are fallen too, as is all nature.

[Hansc]

I thought this was a timely article.

"Pastor Andy Stanley recently left some Christians questioning his stance on homosexuality after preaching a message on grace and truth that included an account of a gay couple last month. He told The Christian Post he may issue a statement in the near future.

In the meantime, he pointed people to his 8-part message series on what it means to be Christian, which concludes this Sunday.

"We are requesting that everyone watch the entire series: Christian. It concludes this. . ."


Christian Post